Photo: "The Human Experiment."

Photo: “The Human Experiment.”

Two, it empowers people. For me, I felt going into this issue with two young children — I had another child while making this movie, [making it three now] — I would become very upset. I just wanted to crawl in a cave somewhere because there’s nothing safe to buy. But the more I bought better products and fewer products — because that’s another way you can contribute while saving money — the more empowered I felt. As a parent and as a person, I would go to the store and say to myself, “I don’t want to support that company with my dollars because they don’t care about my health or my children’s health.” So it empowers people not to be scared, and it sends a very clear message to companies that we’re not going to stand for these bad products.

GALO: You touched on this briefly there in “Switch to Safer,” and it’s an issue  that is present in another tagline on the movie’s Web site: “Vote with Your Dollars.” A concern arises that safer products tend to be more expensive. How do you think reforms can make safer products more accessible to the average consumer?

DN: It’s an interesting question because sometimes we get notes on our Facebook that we shouldn’t support big companies that are moving toward safer products. There’s this anti-big company sentiment. But I totally disagree with that. I feel like we need to pressure big companies by not buying their traditional products. I think the people who can afford the more boutique products should buy them, for sure. Those are great companies doing amazing work, but like you said, not everyone can afford those. So it’s imperative that big companies move in this direction.

Also, in regard to products being too expensive, there are other options. I go to Costco to buy vinegar and a big thing of baking soda [to use as cleaning products]. They last forever and they’re super cheap. (I also buy other products because I like my house to smell nice.) When you learn how to do that, you can almost cut your cleaning budget to nothing. I know it’s hard because I struggled with it, too. It’s not for everyone, but it can work in combination. There are simple things you can do like detoxifying your house by opening your windows more or buying some house plants.

GALO: So it’s a matter of education as well.

DN: Yeah. I think that’s another thing with our “Switch to Safer” campaign. We can all do these things and put our ideas out there on social media. You can say, “Hey, I cleaned my house today with whatever essential oil and vinegar.” Then other people can do the same thing. There is already a pretty vibrant community dealing with these things. We feel like our job is to have this movie reach the people that aren’t a part of this choir already, those who can join this band of people. And the amazing people that are already really committed have so many ideas. So I think I’ve learned a lot from that community and I’m hoping everybody can [do so as well].

GALO: In the film, the chemical industry uses PR as a very effective tool to discredit scientific evidence and silence reformers. Do you think documentary filmmaking is the other side of that coin? An opposite force?

DN: Oh, for sure. That’s one of my favorite topics. I’ve been going to a lot of film festivals over the last couple of months, and I only watch documentaries when I go. I’m always so proud to sit in the audience and consider myself among documentary filmmakers. The work that they do is so amazing. I’m thinking specifically of The Hunting Ground, a new movie about college sexual assault, which is just everywhere. The colleges can’t deal with it or spin it because documentary [filmmaking] can take this deeper dive into something.

This [chemical] issue was a really daunting issue to deal with. There’s a huge lobbyist and PR machine behind the other side. Our hope is that this can just educate and make people think. If they’re so inclined, maybe they’ll make some better choices in products. If that happens, it’s a win all around.

To be honest, I consider it a win already because it changed my own actions. It was a bit of an expensive endeavor just to protect my family [laughs]. But I feel like it’s already improved my life and my kids’ life.

GALO: Speaking of other documentary filmmakers, this is one of a number of projects you’ve completed with Don Hardy. What was it like to co-direct this project with him? Did you agree the whole way through or did you debate how to best execute your goals?

DN: Gosh, no we definitely did not agree all along [laughs]. We did our first three films together, then we each did a fourth film independently. I think every film is always a collaboration. On my own fourth project, I collaborated with my editor, the animator, and all these other people. It’s a lot of give and take. But when you’re co-directing, it’s just a lot more discussion every day on every little thing. It’s a big relationship definitely. But it’s also helpful to share the burden, or share the responsibility, I should say.

GALO: You also collaborated with actor Sean Penn on this film and on others as well. How did that get started?

DN: So Don and I worked on a film about 9/11 in 2002, in which we interviewed all of the Bay Area families of victims. Through that, we befriended Jack Grand Colas, who lost his wife on flight 93, which was bound for San Francisco. Around that same time, Jack befriended Sean because he was also working on a project about 9/11. We all stayed friends with Jack through the years.

When we were making our first film, about wrongful conviction, we told Jack about it, and he said, “Oh I think my friend Sean might be interested.” And we didn’t know who he meant, so we said, “Sean who?” He says, “Sean Penn,” and we say, “Yeah, right. Like Sean Penn is going to be interested in our little independent film.”

For about two years, Jack kept saying, “I’ve talked to Sean about it and he’s interested. I can see there’s a twinkle in his eye. Keep the faith. He’ll come to you.” We always agreed that if [Sean], one day, came to narrate our little film, we’d change the name of our company to KTF Films. And one day, Jack said, “You’re going to get a call to be at Sean’s place in an hour.” And that’s exactly what happened. He was watching the film while we were driving up to his house. When we get there, he comes out into the driveway and says, “You didn’t need to come all this way.” Our hearts just dropped. And then he continued, “Because I love it. I’m in.”

So he’s been amazing to us. This is our third collaboration with him. He never wants to overstep. He never wants to give us advice when we’re dying for his advice.

GALO: It must be an interesting working relationship. I’m sure his support helps your films, but is it mutually beneficial?

DN: I don’t know if it helps him. We were joking around once when he said, “I love working with you guys because I seem so prolific.” And we just laughed because this guy does more work than anybody else. I don’t think it helps him any, but a stamp of approval from him goes a long way for us.

GALO: This film was initially finished back in 2013, right?

DN: Yes, we premiered it back in November of 2013.

GALO: That’s about a year and a half ago. With the theatrical distribution and VOD release coming up, do you think there will be any shift in audience reception since you first premiered it? Or do you expect about the same reaction?

DN: I don’t know. You alluded earlier to how slow this issue has grown in the American public. That’s interesting because it’s taken us so long to do this project. At the beginning, I feared the issue would peak by the time we had finished. But it totally hasn’t. I mean, this all started with “Silent Spring,” [a book by Rachel Carson], back in the ’70s. Like the little engine that could, people are starting to understand more and more, little by little. I think the reaction is only going to be increased every month that goes on, because there are more people who understand, more people joining parents groups, more people just buying one better product, even more people who don’t know about it but see the organic shampoo and consider it. I think it’s hard because there are a lot of powers against the issue, especially if you lump in the GMO issue. There’s a lot of information and stressful decisions coming at people. I’m hopeful that the reception will be as good, if not better, now [than it was in 2013].

GALO: I know Don is planning to work more with Sean on the project in Haiti, but what’s next for you? Are you going to be working on that as well or are you moving in other directions?

DN: Right now, I’m deciding what my next steps are. I’m pitching a film at Hot Docs in a couple weeks on guide dogs. I’m going to follow a litter of puppies during the duration of their two year training to see which ones make it and which ones don’t. There’s this crazy vetting process. It’s going to be pretty cute, so I’m excited to pitch that to see where it goes.

Then I have a couple of other ideas I’m working on, but I haven’t nailed them down yet. I’m hoping in the next year to work on at least one short and one feature. Oh, and of course Batkid Begins is coming out on June 26. That’s pretty exciting, too.


Video courtesy of Don Hardy.


Video courtesy of Liza Meak.

To learn more about Dana Nachman’s current and future endeavors, you can follow her on Twitter @DanaNachman.